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MQA on Deezer?


Hi community.

I am a new user, considering a Deezer subscription.

I am cancelling my Tidal subscription, after I have learned about the scam that MQA really is. 
(watch this youtube video and references).

Basically, MQA introduces distortion and artefacts into the music, and not complying to the claimed sample rates an bit depths. All the time while telling the DAC hardware which lights to turn on, so the user is tricked into believing the stream is ‘Master’ or ‘Hi-Res’ quality.

 

So, I don’t want to support that, and am looking for an alternative.

Now I see several posts about MQA on Deezer. Screenshots of “384kHz sampling rate” and such. I am not confident that I can trust such claims.


What is the status from Deezer? Are you/they moving into MQA?

 

Kind regards,

 

The Priest

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Best answer by Placido09 21 April 2021, 20:13

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Userlevel 3
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@Rudi already confirmed that Deezer will not implement MQA.

 

Userlevel 2
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Flac is more than good enough. 

Glad to hear! 
Agree, FLAC is good enough for this.

 

Kind regards,

 

The Priest

Userlevel 6

I don't agree. I would've liked to see MQA implemented to Deezer already. There's no reason not to implement it. 

Userlevel 6
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I think the fears and objections of many have been confirmed..

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/mqa-deep-dive-i-published-music-on-tidal-to-test-mqa.22549/

Userlevel 3
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Another user here who switched to Deezer after Tidal’s MQA scandal. Don’t go that way. People care for lossless, hifi audio.

I bet there is an influx of ex Tidal users now. You could implement some things that cater to them.

For example, Tidal desktop has “exclusive mode” and “force volume” option that assures bit perfect playback. It also has gapless playback of continuous albums. Another useful feature of Tidal on PC: in-app selection of output audio device with separate playback settings remembered for each output.

Userlevel 7
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Another user here who switched to Deezer after Tidal’s MQA scandal. Don’t go that way. People care for lossless, hifi audio.

I bet there is an influx of ex Tidal users now. You could implement some things that cater to them.

For example, Tidal desktop has “exclusive mode” and “force volume” option that assures bit perfect playback. It also has gapless playback of continuous albums. Another useful feature of Tidal on PC: in-app selection of output audio device with separate playback settings remembered for each output.

Thank you for selecting Deezer Hifi!

I think Hifi Family is available for selected users, and soon for everyone else I bet? I think Deezer will not go cheap way when providing highest sound possible. They will stay with MP3 as well for now.

You are most welcome to enjoy all your music FLAC without stress of MQA coming. As said, that’s not coming, so find yourself an awesome position and enjoy lossless you always wanted to hear.

FLAC is nowhere to go on Deezer. Thank you again for coming to Deezer.

Userlevel 6
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It's rather sad that many users even here on Deezer demand Hifi quality and then ask if it has, if they don't know the difference, or if they don't have good equipment, it's a waste of money and 320 Kbps is more than enough, the same reason why are users leaving Tidal when they haven't heard the difference yet and MQA was the Holy Grail for them? Of course, one should have what one pays for, and surely the higher quality of the recording is the motivation to get better at listening and enjoy such a beautiful hobby. But here it turns out that a lot of people are buying something that they can't take advantage of and they're just buying a feeling

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MQA is a hoax. After spending a 1 month trial listening and comparing Deezer Hifi and Tidal Hifi. My intial impression was that Tidal sounded better, as the top end sounded more open, but after a while I actually found Tidal fatiguing to listen to, as apparently  MQA is adding stuff that wasn’t there to begin with. A bit like using the sharpness slider too aggresively in a photo editor. 
I am glad that Deezer seems to confirm that they are sticking with flac. Very glad indeed. 

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It's rather sad that many users even here on Deezer demand Hifi quality and then ask if it has, if they don't know the difference, or if they don't have good equipment, it's a waste of money and 320 Kbps is more than enough, the same reason why are users leaving Tidal when they haven't heard the difference yet and MQA was the Holy Grail for them? Of course, one should have what one pays for, and surely the higher quality of the recording is the motivation to get better at listening and enjoy such a beautiful hobby. But here it turns out that a lot of people are buying something that they can't take advantage of and they're just buying a feeling

Well, I for one even hear the difference on my car stereo which is a subpar standard installation. The fuller sound of the flacs make my stereo sound less fatiguing and the overall better timing in the music is quite audible, and very easy to test yourself by switching between mp3 and flac in the app. If you are listening to Deezer through a Bluetooth speaker, using a lesser codec to transmit, you may not hear any difference between premium and hifi, but then again, the better the source the better the outcome will be when you transcode it for your Bluetooth speaker. A bit like recording the artist in the studio in 24bit/96Khz, to preserve as much of the analogue sound as possible, for when it is dilluted further down the line into the consumer formats. 

Userlevel 1

 

It's rather sad that many users even here on Deezer demand Hifi quality and then ask if it has, if they don't know the difference, or if they don't have good equipment, it's a waste of money and 320 Kbps is more than enough, the same reason why are users leaving Tidal when they haven't heard the difference yet and MQA was the Holy Grail for them? Of course, one should have what one pays for, and surely the higher quality of the recording is the motivation to get better at listening and enjoy such a beautiful hobby. But here it turns out that a lot of people are buying something that they can't take advantage of and they're just buying a feeling

Well, I for one even hear the difference on my car stereo which is a subpar standard installation. The fuller sound of the flacs make my stereo sound less fatiguing and the overall better timing in the music is quite audible, and very easy to test yourself by switching between mp3 and flac in the app. If you are listening to Deezer through a Bluetooth speaker, using a lesser codec to transmit, you may not hear any difference between premium and hifi, but then again, the better the source the better the outcome will be when you transcode it for your Bluetooth speaker. A bit like recording the artist in the studio in 24bit/96Khz, to preserve as much of the analogue sound as possible, for when it is dilluted further down the line into the consumer formats. 

24bit/96khz are purely about mastering overhead, they have no tangible use for final master playback.

16bits provides “typical” range of 96dB, with a good shaped dither you can get up to 110dB of range. 24bits provides 144dB of range, but most audio hardware has noise that is a lot louder than -144dB, more like -120dB, this means that you can turn up the volume after recording by an extra 20dB before noise becomes a problem, this is plenty of headroom for EQing and balancing a mix, once the mixing has been done, you do not need more than about 60-70dB of range, most living environments have a noise floor of about -50dB, that would require to you play your audio back at deafing loud volume to get the “full range”...just like how movies have stupidly quiet dialog. And a bit of noise -70dB below the max volume isn’t going to “ruin” the audio, infact dithering the method of reducing the amount of bits ads a little bit of noise because it “disperses” the energy of the quantization across the entire spectrum instead of concentrating it in once place, things like “shaped” dither push the energy in to places where the human ear can’t hear it, and get more than “theoretical” by basically cheating the human ear (but I assume dogs hate it lol).

96khz makes recording device design easier, it’s very hard to design a high roll-off analog low-pass filter, which is required otherwise you’ll get aliasing artifacts (in picture form this would be a “moire”, and definitely happens when you’re recording 1080p content on a 4k camera without an anti-aliasing lens), but it’s a lot easier to make a high roll off digital filter…You’re better off actually listening to 44.1/48khz sources with a decent high quality digital lowpass done in the mastering stage, because most hardware is actually only designed to playback sound below 24khz (i.e half the sample rate), and there are records of devices malfunctioning (with you guessed it aliasing!) when playing back sound above 24khz.

 

16/48 was picked because it covers 99.9% of the human experience, CD audio was “compromised” down to 44.1 so that the entirety of Beethoven's 9th could fit on a single disc, modern digital low pass filters a good enough to provide a passband of only 2kHz without distortion, leaving the full 20kHz human range intact.

 

Oh and digital data does not suffer from generational loss like analog data, digital data is self repairing, if a voltage level drops by 5%, and you end up with a “95%” value, then a digital system repairs it back to 100%, and does not randomly flip the bit to 0%, under high damage scenarios, like scratched audio CDs, the bit’s can even be flipped and repairing can be achieved via space efficient redundancy systems like error correcting codes.

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Very detailed feedback, very interesting and knowledgeable take on the formats @woobilicious super appreciated!

I'll keep you in the loop for future discussions on HiFi here at Deezer :sunglasses:

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For example, Tidal desktop has “exclusive mode” and “force volume” option that assures bit perfect playback. It also has gapless playback of continuous albums. Another useful feature of Tidal on PC: in-app selection of output audio device with separate playback settings remembered for each output.

There is a related idea on this forum where you can vote for it:

Gapless playback is available on mobile devices in the meantime, but not in their desktop app and web player yet.

Userlevel 6
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That's not entirely true, gapless doesn't work when streaming from the mobile version via Chromecast.

MQA = Minimum Quality Assurance.

I thought the expensive gear I was auditioning has a tendency to buzz/high harmonics that was tiring, but that was due to MQA.

I discovered other HiFi services do not have that fatiguing ringing, which is only exacerbated by the typical Sigma-Delta DACs.

A non-oversampling DAC without a digital filter, plus a true lossless service like Deezer can truly “deliver”.
I only wish there was a competitor in form of DSD streaming. Then we could forget about vinyls...

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